EP 16 | Lebear James

Grizz (00:31)
for all the marbles.

Ice Bear (00:33)
This little lighter gris, he's gonna make you jizz.

Grizz (00:38)
or ooh I was gonna say I was gonna look at Riz but I think we're just going all the way to third I like that I realize I forgot my cup from last time it's gross

Ice Bear (00:40)
You

Yeah, just straight to a hundred.

I also

forgot mine, so this is going to be the first episode of Many Moons that we don't have the official Two Bears Two Beers ⁓ vessel. But I have a good backup, so it's OK.

Grizz (01:04)
Damn.

I don't have a backup, so...

Ice Bear (01:12)
I mean, beer is already spoiled. It's fine. Or you could drink them out of the can. Well, so I was actually going to be in that boat because the vessel I want to drink out of is my horn. And then I was like, but wait, old Grizz needs to see him. I also got the, I was going to pour like that much so you could see the color. And then I was going to put the rest in the horn.

Grizz (01:17)
I've done worse things in my life.

How are you going to see the beautiful colors?

That's what I'll do. I'll pour just a little bit and have a gross beer so people can see the color and then the rest like a heathen. ⁓

Ice Bear (01:43)
And then the rest of it just go out of the can. Yeah,

you could even just pour it just the tiniest bit in there and not even drink it. my God, you went rogue. You snapped it early. Fine. Okay.

Grizz (01:55)
I'm sorry.

I'm distracted. I got distracted. It was involuntary.

Ice Bear (02:02)
We're off the rails already. We should we shouldn't tell them why. Much like many moons ago, when we first started this adventure, we had another ⁓ a misfire. This time, it wasn't us being depressing. This was true technical difficulties. We were impeded. Not on our part. No thunderstorms. I didn't forget to pay a bill. Rudy didn't punch the Comcast guy in the head. This was just

Grizz (02:05)
Okay.

And not on our part.

Ice Bear (02:31)
unbeknownst to us, our recording software just didn't want to work. So in light of that, we have already consumed our usual two beers allotted for the two bears. So I thought it'd be fitting that I would, ⁓ in honor of those, just give them a fond farewell for what would have been in a glorious episode.

beach haze, sassy little Miami style guy, Santa on the beach. Now I don't remember if I liked it or not. I feel like it was okay. I feel like it was okay. But the one I do remember clearly, and I'm sad that you didn't get to experience with us is hoser juice, a beloved 10.8 beaver with his hockey stick, Canadian flag, haunces, canoes, Mounties.

Grizz (03:04)
Ha ha.

Look at that.

That's such a beautiful...

Ice Bear (03:26)
And as of time of recording, is Canada Day, so happy Canada Day, fellow Maples.

Grizz (03:32)
That makes me proud to be, I guess a Texan, but for the Canada version.

Ice Bear (03:41)
It all comes back to big techs.

Grizz (03:44)
So me I'm just redoing mine because mine were in a four pack and a six pack So I was gonna a little deja vu like that black cat in the matrix but because of that because of because of The horrors we went through and because of the pain I'm having a third and With that one. That's one I've had often not often. It's been a while

I don't think I've had it on here. And so I'm going to introduce a brewery that I do like from a beer that I do like. This is an old Dallas, Texas. This is a

⁓ Beautiful, beautiful hazy EPA.

Brewed by Manhattan Project Beer. Manhattan Project, super awesome. Great, great brewery, great tap room. All their stuff is bomb based. This is the double half life.

Ice Bear (04:38)
⁓ shit.

yes,

I remember the first time I watched you consume this and I was immensely jealous.

Grizz (04:59)
This right here is a 8%. This is an 8 % that pairs well with aged Gruyere biscuits and garlic. The double Half Life is the Goldilocks of IPAs. It's not that bitter, not too sweet, and not too dry. It's just right. As the name implies, it has all the same characteristics of Half Life, which is one of their own other beers. It's a great, great, great, great daily drinker.

Ice Bear (05:24)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Grizz (05:28)
But more, it's juicier, hazier, and a bit hoppier. And definitely higher on the ABV, and yes, it's just as crushable. Bitterness scale, perfectly in the middle.

Ice Bear (05:42)
Alright, two things pop in my head as you read us that tantalizing yarn. One, more beer cans need to have pairs with. I love that. It's fantastic when you're like, all right, man, what do I want to have for dinner? Now you fucking know, or at least you know what you're doing is like a snack. So I'm glad you pick that one first because I also got in a bit of a pinch.

Grizz (05:54)
Yeah, same.

Yep.

Ice Bear (06:10)
trying to think of three and I just thought I'd start with one that I've already had before. One that I enjoy immensely. One from a brewery we know and love. This is from Flying Monkeys. It is the return of Alien Mastermind, the beloved 10.3 % mango hazy triple. So we're most assuredly off to a good start. And to that I say clinky clinky.

Grizz (06:34)
Goddamn.

Ice Bear (06:46)
Yep, just as good as I recall. I forgot to pour it into the horn. This is terrible. I'm drinking out of a glass like a chump.

Grizz (06:56)
Trump bucket.

Ice Bear (06:59)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

So, let's see, what's new in the world? What's going on with you, fella?

Grizz (07:13)
⁓

Not much. like, thing now for me is, ⁓ getting kind of like getting ready to try to make the move. It's like basically three weeks away. Yeah.

Ice Bear (07:23)
Mm-hmm. That's common. So

have we determined is old Grizz being a driving bear? You flying and shipping the old vehicle?

Grizz (07:34)
So I haven't really.

That's what I can't like that's I'm still debating that to be honest. Cause the ship it. It'll probably cost as much.

is to like drive there because it's probably won't be that much as far as like gas and stuff goes

Ice Bear (07:57)
2000 miles so you figure what four tanks five tanks

Grizz (08:00)
Yeah

Yeah And so you know 10 years like less than 30 bucks I get all north 40 bucks a little more a little more north of 50 bucks. I think I probably cap out like a 60 so I

Ice Bear (08:16)
I don't think it's

going to cost you 60 to fill that in Washington. It's what, $5 a gallon?

Grizz (08:21)
Yeah.

Ice Bear (08:23)
But you're like 250 in Texas. So yeah, it's double whatever you're paying, guess. Shit.

Grizz (08:26)
Yeah.

Yeah, so yeah,

because I'm averaging like 28 to 31, depending on like where it swings up, know, 20 30 cents.

Ice Bear (08:40)
Now do you let your tank go bone dry? Are you like a fill it halfway kind of fella?

Grizz (08:43)
I

usually try to fill it a quarter tank at a quarter tank, but there's times they don't happen. Typically I'm a quarter tank, but there's times where like, Hey, I didn't fill up yesterday. I got to get to work. I know I have enough to get to work. I'll just put a little bit of gas when I

Ice Bear (08:49)
Mm-hmm.

I'm

Grizz (09:05)
after I get off of work and then get home. So sometimes, sometimes when I'm, you know, being a little lazy the day before, I've had to run my tank a little, a little close to the end.

Ice Bear (09:19)
Ever since they updated cars with the miles till empty sensor, I can't bring myself to fill it until it's like 20. I'm like, all right. Because I know where, like I know how far I am to the nearest gas station. Why am I going to fill it now?

Grizz (09:29)
That's fair.

That's fair. So my only reason why I try to fill a little earlier is that, and I don't know how true this is for newer cars, but I know for older cars, like constantly running it to empty and everything like it puts wear and tear on your fuel pump. Yeah. And so that's what I learned. So like, you know, I don't know how much of that is an old wives tale or is it how, you know what I mean? But

Ice Bear (09:53)
does it.

Grizz (10:02)
I grew up learning that that would put a necessary thing on your fuel pump and everything. So try to not.

Ice Bear (10:08)
shit now I

have to fill up sooner I don't like that

Grizz (10:12)
Yes, I buy but they asked with older cars right because most of the knowledge that I learned was like an older cars. And these newer cars, you know, some of a little weird.

Ice Bear (10:17)
That's fair.

Grizz (10:24)
and I are in the and all tracks arose and and his kid are are are some base.

Ice Bear (10:35)
Yes, that is true. That is indeed true. The other thing I suppose though, going for your method would be what if you're in a traffic jam or you break down, stop like you would, I guess you would, I probably should start filling it up sooner.

Grizz (10:36)
Yeah.

I think a quarter tank's a good half way, because I never got the half thing. I guess that's responsible. I've also known like, I knew a guy that would, he was like super money saver wise, but he also like hated the libs. And ⁓ he's like, his gas prices are terrible. he's like, the only way can really kind of save money, you go, is you fill up every day.

Ice Bear (10:56)
Yeah, that seems right.

This is this is like the shack thing. Do you know what I'm talking about on the NBA tonight with him and Chuck and Kenny the Jet and Ernie? Have you seen that one?

Grizz (11:25)
these gas these casps he's like these gas press

I

no, I'm not about gas.

Ice Bear (11:39)
There's a thing where Jet was thinking about getting a new car or something, and he was worried about it costing. So Shaq's like, you just wait till it gets halfway and fill it up. You'll save money. And they were all just trying to explain math to him. They're like, that doesn't make any sense. You're not going to spend like, yes, you're spending less, but you have to fill it up more often.

Grizz (12:01)
So

yeah, I mean, so his is a little less dumb than that because he was, but he was like, the damn libs are making the gas process more expensive. It flings back and forth. I fill it up every day. Sometimes I get it at $3. Other times it shoots up at 320, but other times it goes down. So he's like, so they don't bleed my dry as they don't believe me dry as much. I get it every single day. I win some, I lose some. It's like playing the stocks.

Ice Bear (12:27)
⁓ my god

Grizz (12:28)
I'm like, I mean, I guess fair, but you know how much like time you're wasting?

Ice Bear (12:34)
that really does seem like a massive waste of time. And also it feels like not stocks, it feels like when you're playing Animal Crossing and you purchase the turnips from that lady.

Grizz (12:48)
Yeah, it's essentially what it is because basically it's like, because sometimes they shoot up overnight and then like you're going from like 280 and then it's like 320. You're like, fuck, bro. I should have filled up yesterday, but he motherfucker did fill up yesterday. So like, know, so that's kind of like, is they like yesterday? I did yesterday.

Ice Bear (12:56)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-mm-mm.

I

have a buddy that swears by using marine fuel.

Grizz (13:13)
There it is.

Ice Bear (13:15)
So we live near a rez that has a place where like boats can come fill up. And you technically speaking can put this in a car. And I don't know what the rating would be, but I assume it's something equivalent to premium or maybe even a little bit higher. And from what he says, the gas mileage is 20 % higher on average. I'm just scared to do it.

Like I'm like, I don't want to. Sure. Yeah. If I ever fix my truck. Yeah, I'll put it in there.

Grizz (13:44)
That's fair. I would do like an old car. I just tried out. like, yeah,

yeah, because like, you know, and you just buy any kind of want to do this. This isn't a vehicle to

Ice Bear (13:57)
You just don't want to fuck around with it.

Grizz (13:59)
Now in all tracks, so Rose is about to be at his return. Like, like how his counterpart Axl Rose came back like 20 years later, you know, when tracks are coming back like that. And he's like, you know, know, when he's like that, then then, all right, give him a little bit of marine fuel.

Ice Bear (14:13)
No.

100%.

Grizz (14:24)
But

for right now, just give them a nice balanced diet. Let them live a little longer.

Ice Bear (14:31)
I'm with you. I'm with you. How's old Hoppenheimer doing over there?

Grizz (14:40)
this beer honestly so like double half life is it's a good crushing beer i would this one this one's like a b plus like a bb plus it's one that's like it's not amazing but like like i think when you try it and you have you like that's a good fucking beer like that's like that's all there's just a good fucking beer you're happy when you're happy when you drink it you're never disappointed

Ice Bear (14:55)
Hmm.

Yeah, I'm very,

it's one of the ones that you've, I think the only thing that I'm more excited for that you've had that as soon as I come to Texas, the first thing I want to try find is that blackberry sour. One, because of the art, two, just because the way you describe it, like, that sounds perfect. It just sounds so perfect.

Grizz (15:22)
Martin House converted me single-handedly.

Ice Bear (15:25)
Yeah.

It seems like if I were a Texan, it would be my favorite brewery, I think. From everything you've told me, I think it would be them.

Grizz (15:34)
They're definitely up there.

I think

Martin House is the most, ⁓ I think my favorite brewery still is Celestial. ⁓ But they just fucking, they have the E plus dialed in like to a ridiculous degree.

Ice Bear (15:45)
Another great one.

Who did Bonjuk? Who did the Banana King?

Grizz (15:58)
That's a smart house. See, see like Martin house, Martin house has like the longbrews, like barrel aged stuff. Martin house I think is more as a whole is completely better because they fucking knock out IPA is they have amazing sours. have amazing stouts. All of them have amazing art. It's just one of those words just like they don't miss.

Ice Bear (16:25)
It seems like they really don't, which is fantastic and very impressive. I also have a confession to make. So today, ⁓ for the first time in many moons, ol' ice bear went for a scamper. I went for a run, because my brother-in-law and I are planning on doing a marathon in October. And I was like, I probably shouldn't just do that day of with no training whatsoever.

Grizz (16:47)
this.

That sounds terrible.

Ice Bear (16:54)
So was like,

all right, today I'm gonna start. And so I did a 5K and it was pretty hot today, like warmer than usual for us for sure. So I obviously sweat my ass off and then Sierra and I went to the gym and I haven't really had food today. So I will tell you this here, alien mastermind is hitting slightly harder than usual. So I'm gonna need you to rein me in.

Grizz (17:17)
.

Ice Bear (17:24)
I'm gonna need you to clock me on likes for a minute. And I will not be offended if I'm rambling.

Grizz (17:24)
Yeah.

Alright, I'll keep that in mind. That's one like nowhere near as crazy as a marathon. That's absolutely wild. But I think the most labor intensive thing is old mama gris. You try to get me and the tiger to do a Spartan race with her.

Ice Bear (17:54)
those look fun.

Grizz (17:55)
They look really fun, but I was like, I don't got time for that.

Ice Bear (17:59)
You know, the other thing is, all right, correct me if I'm wrong. Is the Spartan race similar to Tough Mudders in the sense that you like, okay. So my other concern is pink eye. I don't want to be like mud in my eyes for two hours.

Grizz (18:05)
Basically, yeah.

Yeah, so mean, I guess I don't think there's as much mud as the tough mudders. Those are a little wild, but basically you do have to close out powerful.

Ice Bear (18:23)
I remembered that the people like it. So I was like, I should stop going away from the mic. I'm being bashful.

Grizz (18:26)
You know

You know what that reminds me of? I mean, it's one of my all-time favorite movies ever, is Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 2 with Taka and Rezar.

Ice Bear (18:40)
Is that the one with shredder in the or not?

Grizz (18:42)
It's yeah,

so was this with use right and so they to fight them shredding the scientists they make I think it's like a wolf I got a wolf pop in a fucking snapping turtle and they make Taka and razor and there's to fight them and I think one of the best things ever in that holding and like It's ⁓ so it's going they finally unveil Taka and razor where they put They have the cage of the wolf pop in the fucking

snapping turtle they put the ooze and they come out all crazy and they start banging on the doors to try to get released and but they're and and ⁓ so they go out and they're going as they finally he released they releases them and shutters like taka razor right it's like you should to call me master and then the tooth like they're out there and they're like

Mama. And then this happy turtle's like, ⁓ mama. And then they all go, they all start hugging him. And then shredders pissed off. He's like, babies. They're both babies. Because they are babies. And the imprint on shredder is their mom.

Ice Bear (20:03)
So good.

Grizz (20:04)
fucking love that scene so much but I don't know right now like what she just did just shot me back to like them

Ice Bear (20:12)
You're welcome. I'm glad you got to relive that. So. I don't know if this happens to you, but occasionally when I'm I'm driving and I'm listening to whatever we've we've put out, so like I was listening to the episode 15. There are certain things that I don't remember us talking about at all. And there those are the funniest parts were like, when the fuck did we say that? And I'm just cackling in the car on the way to work.

Grizz (20:32)
1,000%. 1,000%.

Ice Bear (20:43)
It's such a, it's such a fun thing. And then I'm immediately like, is this funny to anyone other than us? Probably not. I think it's just, you have to be privy to the moment to enjoy it. But that's, that's the best thing about this. Even if it never amounts to anything, the harfs during and then the post-harf harfs. ⁓ so worth it. So fucking worth it.

Grizz (20:58)
You

Cause there's some of them and what's funny is like thinking about it I'm trying to think of like specific ones. ⁓ But there are some that just catch me completely off guard that I totally forgot about.

Ice Bear (21:25)
Well, the one that got me the other other day I was in line at the drive through and it was the part where you had left to grab your second beer and I called you a communist and a Che Guevara. And I totally forgot I did that. And then when you came back, I was just like, I was telling the people that I loved you and you're a great guy. And then when I left, you're like, yeah, he's a great guy.

Grizz (21:37)
Yeah.

You

Ice Bear (21:54)
It was, it was, it was like the reverse moral compass of the one where I was like, you should donate the animal shelters. It was the exact opposite.

Grizz (21:59)
You

Ha ha ha!

Oh shit, that's so funny. There was, oh man. There's been a couple where I totally forget what we talk about or like we just mention a random thing. And it just kills me. forgot. There was one specifically. forgot. It's going to fucking kill me. But I remember, what's funny is I remember like, I remember even editing it too, but I like blow through the edits as fast as possible. And you had, you had heard it. I listened to it before I re-listened to it after.

Ice Bear (22:21)
Mm-hmm.

Grizz (22:40)
and you had said something about like mentioning what was said and we're cracking up and I was like, oh yeah, but I didn't completely remember it. And then I listened to it back and I was like, fucking dying laughing because it was right now I can't even remember it, which is even funny. Now, I wasn't bat nipples.

Ice Bear (22:59)
Was it bat nipples?

is really good. One of the other things I've been thinking about as we've been going along with this because I feel like both of us are having more fun as this goes along and we're enjoying the post episodes more and more. I'm wondering for an outsider, there's gotta be a point where like, yeah, you can just skip the first like X number of episodes and I'm wondering where is the episode that

it's dialed in enough that we're kind of proud of it.

Grizz (23:35)
That's true, that's a good point. That's one thing, because that's a very real thing, right? Like, it's kind of like how much of these episodes are shitty or like, where we get to a point where like, it's a thing.

Ice Bear (23:48)
Right, because it's certainly there's self-indulgent moments, but also I think episode two or three was the the first NFL or the NBA or the like the mascot thing, which I do think is amusing because that's has a wide fan base. So of course you'd be interested because we're talking about something relevant to more than us.

Grizz (24:02)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Which is rare.

Ice Bear (24:14)
But at the same

time, there's some good harfs, some good harfs along the way.

Grizz (24:21)
Yeah, especially with like, every time we nostalgia bait, it's not bad.

Ice Bear (24:27)
Yeah, there's definitely something to if you're between, don't know, what would you say, like 30 and 40? Like if you're in that age range, I think we reminisce about things that are relevant. Probably the zoomers are totally lost and definitely Gen X and boomers are like, what the fuck are these shits talking about?

Grizz (24:35)
Yeah.

Yeah.

I

think zoomers would probably be less lost because like the whole 90s wave came back in the early 2000s. You know what I mean? It's probably not as bad.

Ice Bear (24:54)
Okay. I mean, you'd know

better than me because you have the cub, but I don't know what the Ute's like. I just know my socks are now nerdy.

Grizz (25:05)
Yeah, I've always been. I wasn't already been, but I'm hip now. I'm hip to the drive.

Ice Bear (25:11)
You have the quarter socks?

Grizz (25:13)
So I didn't of course I work crew I work crew socks to kind of just lie down but But I always wear boots so I like constantly

Ice Bear (25:17)
You son of a turkey.

I

was gonna lean away and I was like, No, I'm just gonna fully commit every time tonight.

I should clean the microphone. This is disgusting.

Grizz (25:34)
Should we go on to the next one? I think so. All right.

Ice Bear (25:36)
The next beer. Yeah, I'm done. I'm ready to

go. Alien Mastermind, by the way, it stays an A. It was great. I'm so I'm really happy I started with that.

Grizz (25:44)
Yeah.

Double Half-Life, think B plus is good. Honestly, it's just a fucking solid beer When they say it's the Goldilocks like it's not too bitter and not too everything it's truly is it's it's just one that's it's an 8 % So it's a good ABV Not super bitter not super juicy not super hobby. It's just it's fucking perfect

while you go I'm going to give this okay so these next two beers were my beers for our first time we try to drink and we are gonna see maybe we'll upload whatever salvageable this one beer is from a brewery that I do like so this is actually very disappointing and the name is fucking amazing because if anybody knows me I'm a really big fan of Texas

Ice Bear (26:40)
Mm-hmm. Yes, you are.

Big Tex.

Grizz (26:41)
So

everything about this is something I should like NFL very short. I was hugely disappointed. I couldn't even, I couldn't hide it. It was, I was having a very bad time.

Ice Bear (26:57)
You're having a meltdown.

Grizz (26:59)
So this is from Texas Sale Project. They're a great brewery. They're probably the closest brewery to me. ⁓ This is a Blood Orange EPA. They say it's bright and juicy. It's a 6.5. It's called Texas Blood. Right. This is a...

Ice Bear (27:14)
Mm-hmm.

I'm proud of you for getting this out of the way first. Good job.

Grizz (27:19)
Yeah,

so this is Texas Blood and I kind of got it because like Texas Blood's that's cool shit. There's also a song from a band called Upon A Burning Body, which is from my hometown. They have a song called Texas Blood Money and the chorus is Everything Is Bigger In Texas. Lord, a double barrel blow up to pieces. But anyways, good song. But yeah, this is Texas Blood. It's a blood orangey, but

Everything about this should be stitches bang bang. Everything about this should be amazing.

Ice Bear (27:56)
It seems like

it should be really good.

Grizz (27:59)
And so we'll see if this falls short again, because it really left me a little sour.

Ice Bear (28:06)
you

you did seem sour last time so all right two things i'm going to go with one

have to confess again, I am clearly feeling the alien mastermind because one thing that, yes, the mind control, but one thing I do when I start to get buzzed or tipsy is I'm like hyper fixating on the timer and I never do that the rest of the time. Because most episodes we get, I'm like, how the fuck are we at two hours already? But now I'm like.

Grizz (28:24)
mind control.

Ice Bear (28:42)
minutes and 12 seconds. Okay. Uh 28 minutes and 47. Okay. And I'm just like watching the clock like what it seems like longer. No, it seems like shorter and I just like fixate on it. So, yes, I'm having a hoot. Don't pollute. Tootsie rolls. I'm the little owl. My second beer is also from Flying Monkeys. So, I'm I have high hopes because they never fail and this brings together many things that I like. One, flying monkeys.

Grizz (28:45)
Yeah.

Ooh. Ooh.

Ooh.

Ice Bear (29:12)
Two, relatively strong beer, it's a seven. ⁓ Three, Dia de los Muertos vibes on the art.

Grizz (29:22)
love it. Ooh, I love that.

Ice Bear (29:26)
And then 3CD, I don't know what point I'm on, Superman, because this is Kryptonite 7.0 Smooth Logger.

Grizz (29:36)
Alright, I dig that. I really do like, dude, Flying Monkey says it's great fucking hard. Super psychedelic, but like in all the cool ways, you know?

Ice Bear (29:44)
I just like them because they seem like they don't give a fuck, which is one of the things I appreciate in a person and company more than anything. Just do what you enjoy. Which is looping back to the start of this. It's one of the reasons that I'm happy that we just, eh, we just fucking do what we want. Do what you enjoy. Do what you like. So I do want to read this because they tend to give really good descriptions.

Grizz (29:49)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Ice Bear (30:12)
Kryptonite 7.0 Smooth Lager. Beer form kryptonite is a smooth energetic lager with its own extra dimensional energy. Pour this irresistible liquid in your face and all Earth's weak liquids shall kneel before you. Sneaky with its power, this 7 % lager scoffs at human thirst with a fresh dry finish. All hail Zod.

So I'm amped for the beer and I'm ready for Superman.

Grizz (30:40)
All hail Zod-

Ice Bear (30:45)
This time I'm going to remember to do it my horn, so I'm just going to give you a taste of the color.

Grizz (30:51)
⁓ Here's a color of the blood orange. This should be your first indication that this is not very blood orange-y.

Ice Bear (30:58)
That is a strange color for a blood orange.

Kind of an oddly reminiscent color, actually. All right. all right. Salute.

Grizz (31:07)
Yeah, yeah.

Ice Bear (31:31)
Okay, so.

Here's the thing. I'm very excited to use my horn. ⁓ And I'm also very excited because I think using the mango as my start was a very wise choice. Because more than any other episodes we've done, I'm feeling it midway in. And I think that might have something to do with my high praise for this. But it's great. off the initial is

Grizz (31:56)
Ha ha ha ha!

that's good so I will with this one with this first thing I'm hoping because it's just colder but I did get more orange this time than I did last time well here's the things ⁓ caveat to that is I got more like orange zest like the orange oil flavor as opposed to like blood orange but I'm hoping

Ice Bear (32:05)
It's great.

Well, that's good. That's something.

love you.

Grizz (32:36)
More thinking, more,

more, I'm hoping that.

I get a I'm gonna get more throughout so we'll see

Ice Bear (32:54)
So one thing that keeps coming up when I talk to the seal about our episodes is, earlier in this episode, you mentioned the phrase daily drinker. Do we have drinking problems? Should we explore that? We're fine. We're both OK.

Grizz (33:13)
I think

we're probably the Tigers told me the same thing but like also she has an issue with me drinking zero calorie soda often and I was like I was like there's literally no repercussions to it like ⁓

Ice Bear (33:23)
nerds.

I also got yelled

at for drinking zero calorie soda the other day. was drinking Pepsi Zero, the electric, the blue one.

Grizz (33:36)
Yeah, there's no repercussions to it. It's a nice cool fizzy drink. There's technological advancements for a reason. That's one of them.

Ice Bear (33:47)
So from what I understand, presumably there are some things that are bad about it, but let's just... It's more fun to ignore them. ⁓

Grizz (33:53)
Yeah, the like the cancer thing that the fact that gave like the, the, the, well, the

fact that they like they, the whole aspartame thing, but they like pump that rat full of like a hundred times his body weight in aspartame and like, it gives you cancer. Well, no shit. When you have a hundred times your body weight or something. Yeah. Shit's going to go bad.

Ice Bear (34:15)
20,000

pounds of Aspartame.

Grizz (34:18)
But like they like pump that motherfuckers chalk full is like I can't believe he got fucking cancer or some shit wrong with them. Yeah, no shit like. ⁓

Ice Bear (34:25)
Can you imagine

if we had 20,000 pounds of aspartame?

Grizz (34:31)
Exactly so again, so you can go fuck all the way off about the cancer thing

Ice Bear (34:39)
All right. I need I need you to correct my memory banks because I'm not sure. Way back when in our podcast of your the the Senpai strength podcast, did we ever have Fred, do we have decks on there? Okay, so I know you know him though. He's a good friend of us and by extension the show. So

Grizz (34:40)
I ain't no rat.

We did not.

Yeah.

Ice Bear (35:08)
he had posted a thing on the gram recently where he was flexing and his bicep looked the size of a fucking person next to him. So I had messaged him, I was like, looking good, bro. Like, I feel like you've got to be like a 27 inch bicep. And he's being bashful about it and pretending to be coy. And he said, and I think he's just sparing my feelings.

I think he's being a nice guy because he said he checked and 17 and I'm just like, bro, I like mine is 18. So there's no fucking unless my body dysmorphia is so fucking insane right now that I'm just bigger than people that in my brain look three times as big as me. It doesn't make sense.

Grizz (35:59)
Well, the thing is also you're like, what, cause you're told in the main is to what you're like six two, six one. ⁓

Ice Bear (36:04)
I'm six one.

Grizz (36:12)
So if you that, know, body proportions are different, if our boys, young shorter, right?

Ice Bear (36:18)
That's true.

I don't, I have no sense of how tall he is.

Grizz (36:24)
Yes, if you put, you know, 510, 580, like, you know, the smaller shit looks they look like it's still like stacked and jacked as fuck, you know.

Ice Bear (36:29)
That's true. never fit.

Yeah,

that's fair. Well, whatever he's doing, he looks great. And congrats to him. ⁓ That is that is one thing. This is one thing I don't think we've ever really gone into on this version of the show. We both enjoyed lifting. I don't think we've ever even talked lifting even a little bit.

Grizz (36:53)
Yeah, I think so actually. Like not once. It's kind of weird talking. It's kind of, it's kind of weird talking about things like when we're just getting drunk.

Ice Bear (36:55)
Interesting because that's

Yeah,

because this is like the exact opposite of we're just punishing ourselves. You remember all that work you did like two hours ago in the gym? You're kind of fucking it up right now. You're kind of doing the exact opposite of what your body needs. You should be hydrating and getting protein and having a nice meal, but now you're fucking destroying the work you did.

Grizz (37:24)
fun though.

Ice Bear (37:24)
It is. There's okay. So yes, it is fun. I 100 % agree. But I remember years ago. I think it was just you and me. I don't think it was the whole group. I think it was just you and me. And it was something to the effect of someone was saying, like, it's really nice, like getting ripped and feeling yourself at a lower body fat and you know, look in the mirror. And then you said something to the effect of

Yeah, but getting fat's fun too. And it's like, it's pretty fucking fun.

Grizz (38:01)
It's true. Look, I've been lean and I've been fat. They're equally as fun for different reasons. And you're equally, you're not equal to these miserable, probably a little more miserable being fat towards the end of the days. Like after like psychological reasons, but like overall, you're pretty upset about shit on both sides of spectrum. Just different things, but both are fun getting, getting there. Both are fun. Just saying.

Ice Bear (38:15)
Sure.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

They are both fun. So I guess it boils down to just fucking enjoy yourself. Do whatever you want to do. Fuck it. Do what you like. Freedom.

Grizz (38:37)
Yeah, it's just, the thing is like,

you can get jacked and also have some beers. Now, will you be as jacked if you had no beers? No. But can you still be jacked and have beer? Yes. 1000%.

Ice Bear (38:55)
I should make that a mission. I should make that a technical mission for the podcast. Fuck it. I'm gonna do it. All right. What's today? Today is July 1. As of recording.

Grizz (39:06)
I but I don't know. It's kind of hard to try to get jacked and think while you're also trying to go on a marathon. That's completely opposite things.

Ice Bear (39:14)
But okay, so, but you have to realize like normie jacked is just being cut. Like just being lean. And I'm already a, I'm a bigger human being. So if I just get cut, I'm jacked by normie standards. So.

Grizz (39:21)
That's true. Okay, yeah, that's actually fair. Yeah, that's fair.

true. Cause cause like

the old photos of you and you're like shredded as fuck. Like when you were like really fucking shredded. How much lighter were you like 20, 30 pounds? If that yeah. yeah. Cause you never broke 200 at this point. Right. Yeah.

Ice Bear (39:42)
50. 50.

Yeah, when I'm

like eight pack, I'm 160, 165. And right now I'm like 215.

Grizz (39:51)
yeah that's yeah

I just true because I remember that time you know you had never broke 200 that was the whole reason why yeah yeah and

Ice Bear (40:00)
I couldn't get there and I tried. You know what the secret

is? You wanna know the secret? America, Canada, drinking is, it's mainly just like have a wife that cooks for you. Like having meals that you want to eat and that you have seconds of, that goes real quick.

Grizz (40:09)
Drinking and eating. Meal eating.

That's fair.

It's really easy to force feed when like it's voluntary and it's Cause I'm telling you like

Ice Bear (40:28)
Yeah, yeah, because,

like, if I'm making food for myself, and that was part of the problem, because it was a egg whites protein shakes, fucking the occasional corn dog challenge from Sonic.

Grizz (40:35)
It's straight just fuel like it's just utilitarian.

It's just utilitarian, right? Yeah. That's fair.

I still think I was on yesterday actually but ⁓ but yeah so for me it's like the opposite like me I love to cook cooking my entire life so no with the tiger

these elaborate you know I cook a good breakfast a good lunch I cook these elaborate dinners and stuff because you know spoiler and all that good stuff right like try to like treat again right but I'm just cooking for myself fucking white rice ground beef and some eggs on top and I'm ketchup on it and I'm set right like or a slab of fucking steak hot cheetos and an avocado and I'm fucking set like you know

Ice Bear (41:15)
if you're a chef.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Grizz (41:36)
And I'm fucking happier than a clam. Like, I'm good. Right?

Ice Bear (41:41)
The

the alligator pair is the best fat in the world in my opinion. It's so good.

Grizz (41:52)
I get it.

Ice Bear (41:52)
Have you

ever had an avocado where you scoop the pit out and just fill that little hole with ketchup? Fucking do it. Do it now.

Grizz (41:58)
No, but I was, ⁓ I mean, like, I

eat avocado and ketchup often in dinner, so I'm sure it's great.

Ice Bear (42:05)
you do it where you either fill that entire pit with ketchup or fill the entire pit with sriracha. And that's, ⁓ it's fucking fire.

Grizz (42:12)
I will suck your fuck,

Best great you said you said alligator and I was like, fuck I fucking love Gator Gator is one of my all-time favorite proteins ever

Ice Bear (42:21)
to have that.

Remember the night you and I were talking, we were like looking at protein, like the macros of all the weird animals. It was like Gator and bison and what what was the bird? There was some bird that freaked us both out. Yeah, it was that. Yeah. Shit ostrich, man. We should eat more ostrich.

Grizz (42:31)
Oh Gators, best approach in the patch.

Is it ostrich? Yeah.

I gotta see this.

Ostrich burgers are dope, they're good.

Ice Bear (42:47)
It's one of those things where I feel bad for people that aren't adventurous with their foods. Because there's so many like proteins out there that are... It's just a totally different flavor. You just don't know until you know.

Grizz (43:06)
Like, like, uh, come on, man, this fucking dude, not honestly, nothing beats a Gator bro. Like 3.5 ounces of Gator, right? 3.5 ounces. So quarter pound quarter pound and Gator, 230 calories, seven grams of fat, 46 grams of protein for a quarter for a quarter pound of Bro.

Ice Bear (43:31)
Don't get-

Yeah, don't get me wrong.

Grizz (43:35)
One

Ice Bear (43:35)
I will.

Grizz (43:36)
pound of meat is almost your daily intake.

Ice Bear (43:39)
don't get me wrong, I will eat that all day. And I will love it. But my favorite protein by far, and forever will be bison. I think and like that slight metallic tinge to it. I don't think there's anything better.

Grizz (43:48)
you're bicing it because it's like cow but sweet. Like a small sweetness to it. It's delicious.

So, so

there's a company in Texas called force of nature. They're dope as fuck. have their farms like a little like south of San Antonio. I don't know. South East. like going to Kerrville. The big one San Antonio. And um, it's forced to nature that they're, they're a, they, they have like, they have ground beef. They primarily sell ground beef. They sell other stuff, but they sell ground beef.

Ice Bear (44:09)
Big ol' women.

⁓ Big ol' cows.

Grizz (44:27)
They bricks of ground beef, have bricks of ground venison. They have bricks of ground elk. They don't really have it as much now, but they do have ground elk here and there. And they have ground bison, right? Which is great. Dope. Awesome. But they have this ancestral blend, right? And every time anybody's ever like kind of like getting into carnivore, like doing whatever shit, and they want to kind of eat more organ meats, they have this ancestral blend. So they have this like this cow ancestral blend, where it's just like

Ice Bear (44:49)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Grizz (44:56)
It's ground beef mixed with ground. So it's ground beef, ground beef liver, ground beef heart, and intestines. So it's like putting the organ meats with the meat. It's fucking dope as shit. And then they came out with this fucking chicken ancestral blend, where it's like the chicken organs. It's it's dope. It's good.

Ice Bear (45:08)
Hmm

⁓

Okay, sorry, brief aside because I can't let this go because a lot of people find it gross. If you've never had chicken liver, or chicken feet, I'm looking at you fellow whites. Try it. They're both phenomenal.

Grizz (45:30)
the chicken feet

chicken feet like grill chicken feet especially the Korean ones where you have like that go to John glaze ⁓ of I prefer the grill to the soup the soup because when it's in the soup it gets a little too gelatinous for me

Ice Bear (45:39)
Ugh, or in a soup?

That's fair.

Grizz (45:49)
but when it's grilled and you see you have like the little like it's a tiny crunch it's almost non-existent but it's there and then and then it's like soft and like almost jello like and it's because for me like i i i don't like organ meat like i don't mind liver liver solid ⁓ sweet bread solid i don't mind that but like ⁓

Ice Bear (45:55)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah.

Grizz (46:12)
like in testing like tripe and like three points stuff. I'm not a huge fan of right because I just I don't like how spongy it isn't springy. It's completely texture thing. I fucking hate it right

Ice Bear (46:14)
Hmm

Hmm ⁓

Grizz (46:22)
But like jellyfish, similar springy texture, but the fact that you have the cartilage and you have that crunch inside it, it takes that away so I can eat that. Cause like when I eat jellyfish, cause like, there's a, there's an Izakaya up here in Dallas called Yama that's dope. And you can get, ⁓ cause what is it? Got it, got it. Right. Like, so like, jellyfish and it's just chopped up jellyfish in this like,

Ice Bear (46:30)
Mm.

Grizz (46:51)
So the sauce is in the stope, right? Like we eat it between some sushi stuff and like, and like beer is fucking solid. But every time I get the first bite I have the first chew I get, always like, because of it's like the gelatinous and I get to the crunch and I'm like, all right, that is fine. And then after that, like I'm good. But like, it's always just that first like bite and it's like springy.

Ice Bear (47:09)
Alright.

Hmm.

Grizz (47:16)
it always ever for everything it always I always have this visceral reaction of where it's just completely textural like texture textures huge for me

Ice Bear (47:22)
interesting.

I'm trying to think of there's

anything texture wise that bothers me. ⁓ you know what one bothers me that a lot of people like and actively seek out. If you make your own pudding at home. pudding skin

Grizz (47:42)
I've been curious because I've seen it in like Rugrats and just random shit, but I've never actually like known about it.

Ice Bear (47:51)
I don't know what

it is, man. It bothers me. I don't like it. But I know now they're to the point where they're selling like pudding skin singles. Apparently people really like it.

Grizz (47:59)
Really?

So what is pudding skin exactly? I never really understood it. Is it like you leave pudding out and it hardens at the top?

Ice Bear (48:11)
No,

so if you make putting at home and you put it in the fridge to to congeal or whatever it's doing in the fridge, the very top layer becomes more solidified and it's almost to the extent of a not a slice of cheese. You know what it's like? It's ⁓ reminiscent of the casing from Jerky.

Grizz (48:14)
Yeah.

Ice Bear (48:40)
So it's just a weird it's for me it's too solid because putting in my mind I should have a spoon take it in and it's just like melts in your mouth but with a pudding skin if you have that on there you spoon it and then there's just as weird like you're like you want to pull it out like that's my immediate reaction every time

Grizz (48:59)
Yeah.

Yeah ⁓

Ice Bear (49:03)
But I guess there's

a handful of people out there that just want to scoop that off the top of their head. Chop down on pudding skin. No, it's not for me.

Grizz (49:10)
I don't think I can fuck with that. I genuinely don't think I can.

I don't think I can fuck with that.

Ice Bear (49:15)
But to each their own. good for you pudding skin lovers. Looking at you. Hold on. Who's number four? Who's number four on the list? Pakistan was three. Is it for Russia or India? Looking at you, India. If you want to be a podium holder like Pakistan, you should stop munching on the pudding skins. I know it's you.

Grizz (49:29)
India.

Yeah.

That's true.

1000 %

Ice Bear (49:45)
You're supposed to

rein me in when I'm being crazy.

Grizz (49:48)
I think that's totally valid, but anyway, you set the fuck up. I don't know if I can tell you.

Ice Bear (49:54)
Our three listers in the air like, what the fuck are you talking about? I've never had pudding in my life.

Grizz (50:02)
It's like, fuck you guys, I don't know else to do anywhere.

Ice Bear (50:03)
You

Grizz (50:08)
Just reminds me like so like okay one of my favorite genres for random videos is like the random Indian guy That like is trying to like be I don't know maybe I guess viral but like trying to be a not self-help but like You know like the alpha male like Like do work fucking grunt sigma grind set kind of thing

So it's like the random Indian guy that tries to be like a Sigma grindset kind of thing. But like there's obviously a slight language barrier. is not his first language, right? Like, so it's like, it's a slight language barrier. The cadence is just weird. And it's just like try hard, but it's like super serious. I know there's a lot of guys like this, right? I have one that I really like, but this, this type of video, like I fucking love. And it's.

Ice Bear (50:51)
⁓ I don't know this guy, but please continue.

Okay.

Grizz (51:05)
I think I've sent so many videos of this to the tiger. She's like, you really like this guy, huh? don't like it. It's so good in all the wrong ways. I love this guy so much. if I like, know what? That's what we're going to do. Where's this guy at? Where's this guy? I'm pulling up one of his videos.

Ice Bear (51:23)
gonna find one? Okay,

well, you're finding this I'm gonna I'm gonna tell you what what made what that made pop in my head. I really like the Korean dude that is flirting with foreigners. Very open minded.

Grizz (51:38)
the Hong or the Hongdae guy do I fucking love the Hongdae guy do you live alone

do you live alone do I have a did you see the video here he's he's like your sleep paralysis demon is a Hongdae guy

Yeah, he's so fucking great.

Ice Bear (51:58)
It's so good!

It's so good with this fucking leather jacket just sitting there being a maniac. ⁓

Grizz (52:04)
Yeah. And then it's highly he's like leaning

on her. He's way I just do you live alone? I tell that to the tiger. I tell it to the tiger like all the time.

Ice Bear (52:13)
A lot?

That guy is so good.

Grizz (52:20)
Why don't you put your number

on my iPhone 16 Pro Max.

Ice Bear (52:24)
hahahaha

Grizz (52:30)
It's so good. It's so fucking good. That dude is like one of the best guys online right now and I don't think it's even close.

Ice Bear (52:40)
he's definitely up there and every time I see him I I go really back and forth on whenever the seal and I go finally have like the time and and and funding to go on vacation I go really back and forth between Japan and Korea because it's going to be one of those because she's never been to either and I love both and I think I think it's Korea

Grizz (53:00)
Yeah.

Ice Bear (53:05)
Because for everything about Japan, Korea is just cheaper.

Grizz (53:06)
The

That's fair. like one of the things like good to try and like talk about the tiger was one thing I've been thinking about with the tiger. And it's like, I think if we can just do a week vacation, I think Korea is the way to go.

Ice Bear (53:25)
Yeah.

Grizz (53:27)
You know what mean? Like, I think Japan needs to be at least two weeks.

Ice Bear (53:31)
I think so, yeah.

Grizz (53:33)
So if you could only go out for a week, five days, has to be Korea.

Ice Bear (53:40)
So one thing about Korea is Seoul is very reminiscent of New York in the sense that from

I can't remember the Korean word for it, like the district, like borough, the borough of Guadalenzi, like ⁓ the difference between parts of Seoul are like Harlem to Manhattan. Like they're drastically different. So you can stay in Seoul the whole time and have a wildly diverse vacation. So you can go to Lottie World and you could go to Dongdaemun. You can be in this giant street mall with like

Grizz (53:57)
yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

Ice Bear (54:21)
5,000 mom and pop vendors. And then 15 minutes later, you walk to a mall that feels like you're 20 years in the future. So I have massive, I have nothing but good things to say about Seoul. Yeah. Yeah.

Grizz (54:32)
Yeah, you know, it's kind of like the different poverty line.

Ice Bear (54:41)
And great food and great bar culture and great... They're just... They're good to foreigners. I don't know. I assume that's because also I try to be very respectful and take the time to learn language and that shit. But... Korea was great. I have nothing but good things to say about it.

Grizz (54:46)
Yeah.

Ice Bear (55:03)
Get Korea in the top 10. Pakistan's ahead of you, Korea.

Grizz (55:05)
I mean, come

on Korea, let's go. Look, I like down to me. I love it actually. So let's make this happen. I'll drink some fucking, I'll drink 2B2B fucking high edition. go.

Ice Bear (55:23)
You

give me give me casts all day every day. I'll have I'll have that and fucking. So do.

Grizz (55:26)
Hey

Alright we're doing soap with crackers everyone and then I'll show you this guy I fucking love this guy this guy's my favorite one over here guys all time right now

Ice Bear (55:37)
Okay,

here's what you should do then, because I not only have to grab my third one, ⁓ but I have to bear tinkle. So I'm gonna say show them a Hongdae moon guy.

Grizz (55:57)
I'll add him. Let me add him. His name's Sean Solo, right? Everybody knows. Y'all have to know this guy. If y'all don't know this guy, it's kind of an issue, right? This guy is fucking awesome. This guy, so he's a hungry warrior. And there's a debate between like, is he just a cool guy playing a hungry boy? which is, you know, which

Ice Bear (56:00)
back.

Grizz (56:25)
These are basically like the Korean fuckboys. So is he playing the fuckboy role or is like, is he a fuckboy just, you know, they can play nice sometimes. So he.

Let's see, let's see what we find.

perfect, we're talking about the gym. We're doing a gym video. You ready for this? Let's see, share screen. Entire screen, we're going.

Oops, I fucked up. I fucked up, doing this. Screen, let's see.

Ice Bear (57:20)
How did it go?

no. no, what happened?

So the whole time I've been gone, nothing has been going on. I was just I was just tinkling and the people are watching nothing.

Grizz (57:30)
Nothing's been going on.

Entire screen, here we go. System audio, here we go. So I'm showing the Hung Day guy right now. This is, we're talking about the gym, we're going gym.

Ice Bear (57:45)
I love it.

Ha

Not the Vida Coco.

Grizz (58:27)
Ha

He's awesome. This guy's fucking great. Love this guy.

Ice Bear (58:36)
The leather jacket and the shorts.

Grizz (58:40)
So good. Now, now we need to crack open a beer for this next guy because it's fucking great. So busting open the soot sprite.

Ice Bear (58:54)
All right, well, because we failed on every other attempt, let's do the three, two, one for this one. Squiggity diggity doo.

Grizz (58:59)
We're we're gonna sink this one. We're gonna give it a score.

All right. I will go Celestial Beer Works technical skillset. 10 % beautiful triple EPA with Strata Galaxy and Strata Hopash. Phenomenal. This, this one saved the day from the terrible Texas blood, which honestly was way better this time. So I will go, yeah, cold help tremendously.

Ice Bear (59:25)
cold helped. That's good.

I'm glad to hear that.

Grizz (59:29)
So I'll give them that but technical skill set celestial be orcs. love y'all three two one go

Ice Bear (59:42)
Okay, I'm just doing kryptonite 7.0 again. ⁓

Grizz (59:46)
That's totally

fine.

Got it all right here. I'm going to pour this so you can see this right here in this little screen.

Ice Bear (59:56)
Which by the way for our Superman fans and our beloved Grizz aficionados, it's an A. Flying Monkeys just is, the Canadian equivalent of Martin House's Flying Monkeys.

Grizz (59:57)
All head.

They don't miss.

I believe it. Look at this fucking color. Look at this fucking color.

Ice Bear (1:00:15)
Can you imagine if they did a CoLab?

That is a beautiful color. I'm excited for you. Wait, I can't remember because I've seen you drink this already and I can't remember your reaction, but it was better than the first one. I know you were like not disappointed anymore.

Grizz (1:00:20)
Amazing. Yeah.

far better. I would say I smelt this.

I smelt this and my fucking like jowls are are watering.

Ice Bear (1:00:36)
So that's actually an interesting thing about the Kryptonite 7.0. And I think it's indicative of the fact that both of us don't generally enjoy lagers. The smell is bad. Like if I was basing my rating off the smell, I'd be like, ugh. But the taste is fantastic. And it's very light. And it's very easy to drink.

Grizz (1:00:50)
interesting.

Ice Bear (1:01:02)
I also think I'm enjoying drinking out of the horn again.

Grizz (1:01:05)
It's a good vessel. Especially since I'm going to Washington, like I'll be in Seattle. I kind of want to see if I can get a Longhorn mug. I'm trying to balance it out. All right. This guy here, I thought can also, again, reiterating, one of my...

Ice Bear (1:01:16)
You should. You should.

What did I do? Why

am I so messy right now? I so, I totally overflowed it. I'm covered in froth.

Grizz (1:01:28)
lord.

Ice Bear (1:01:36)
all over the brand new Reputaz shirt.

Grizz (1:01:39)
I you know.

Ice Bear (1:01:42)
God, terrible. All right, well, sorry.

Grizz (1:01:46)
So here

we go. So this guy over here. So one of my favorite genres is of like, it's with like mainland Indian guys, mainland Indian guys, specifically Indian guys where they try to do like the sigma grindset stuff and it's like serious, or it dances a line if you don't know if he's self aware or he's serious in this like sigma grindset thing. But

Ice Bear (1:02:13)
I'm ready.

Grizz (1:02:14)
⁓ I fucking love it. It hits so hard and I love everything about it. This guy right here, OtkarHim6, we're gonna go to his things. Let's hit it with that. All right. Actually, let me see if I can find, where's, let's see.

Ice Bear (1:02:21)
I don't know where we're going with this, so I'm excited.

I like the energy. He's got a vibe about him.

Grizz (1:02:39)
Yeah,

he does. Again, I really hope it's self-aware.

but like, it dances a line so well that I don't know if it is software or not.

Ice Bear (1:02:54)
interesting.

Grizz (1:02:55)
And that's what makes it so good. Ready?

Ice Bear (1:02:59)
Very interesting.

Yes, I'm ready. Please.

Grizz (1:03:06)
So here you go, right here. ⁓

Ice Bear (1:03:25)
What did you just make me watch? That meant nothing to me.

Grizz (1:03:29)
You made me laugh.

Ice Bear (1:03:30)
You're better than this.

Find a different one because based on that, I do not understand what you like about this.

Grizz (1:03:37)
No, that's why it's great, because it's not good.

Ice Bear (1:03:41)
No, I'm not participating. You have to convince me and that did not. I'm willing to accept more evidence, but that was a bad first showing.

Grizz (1:03:44)
No.

you

No, it's bad. And that's why it's Are you ready for this? Let's do let's go. ⁓

Ice Bear (1:03:58)
Yes, I'm emotionally and mentally prepared.

Grizz (1:04:20)
You

Ice Bear (1:04:22)
well, why didn't you say so? If you'd started with that, I would have understood.

All right, hold on. So based on.

Grizz (1:04:48)
Hahaha!

Ice Bear (1:04:57)
Based on this, do I need to start doing motivational videos and broken Spanish or Tagalog or Japanese?

Grizz (1:05:09)
We gotta hit him with fucking, do one of these.

Ice Bear (1:05:14)
Alright, give me another. Give me one more.

Grizz (1:05:15)
Yeah, like right here. Talk

about talking about the boys. Keep your mind on straight. Don't get distracted.

I fucking love this guy

Ice Bear (1:05:43)
Okay, I could-

I couldn't help but notice as he peeled off in his motorcycle, the building in the background was not built. It was just a shell of a building.

There you have it. There you have it.

Grizz (1:06:10)
me it's okay

ignore me not problem but deep people don't curse me

Ice Bear (1:06:25)
Are you you mewing at me? Are you mewing? ⁓ God, you fucking youths. ⁓ no. You're you're you're a Z, aren't you? You're not even a millennial.

Grizz (1:06:28)
That's what he's doing.

It's so good. It's so good.

No, I think I am overlaid.

Ice Bear (1:06:44)
You filthy Zee, you're a skibbity toy litter.

Grizz (1:06:49)
Nah, if I say I'm that, I just look like the moms clinging to their youth.

Ice Bear (1:06:58)
Hold on, hold on.

doing this in my head because I don't want to release your birthday to the public because I know you have Pakistani stalkers. Thank you for being number three Pakistan. Yeah, you're you're like three years younger than me. It's not a big gap. So yeah, you're a millennial. You're a millennial because the seal is actually the millennial cusp. Yeah, she's right on the cusp if she was like,

Grizz (1:07:17)
Yeah, but yeah, it's not a huge cap.

⁓ she's almost a Z.

Ice Bear (1:07:32)
two months younger, she'd be a zeer, but she's also a millennial.

Grizz (1:07:38)
Yeah, Tiger I think is still strictly millennial.

Ice Bear (1:07:43)
What year? 93? 4? 5? 3? Yeah, she's definitely a millennial.

Grizz (1:07:46)
Three, Yeah.

The weird thing is she's two days off of my younger brother.

Ice Bear (1:07:57)
I don't

Grizz (1:07:58)
Yeah, exactly two days off. The weird thing is that like Tuesdays is a thing. like for me, like my cousin's like I'm two years younger than my cousin. My brother's two years younger than me. I have another cousin's two years younger than my brother. Like Tuesdays is like it's just a number that's like normal.

Ice Bear (1:08:00)
That feels weird.

See it.

That's that's the just acceptable Latino split. That's alright. It's been two years.

Grizz (1:08:25)
Yeah, you could say, you know, we

get we get pregnant young boy, no Irish twins. So that's for sure.

That's a different type of Catholic.

Ice Bear (1:08:35)
Dude,

you ready for a wild one? So on my dad's side, you have...

So they're also alive. have 74, 72, 68, 60, 50. Yeah, my youngest uncle is not like, like he's much younger. Like, and it was to the point where like, objectively an accident, like they thought they were incapable at that point.

Grizz (1:08:58)
damn.

That's fair, because I mean, look, that happens. I know plenty of Mexican families that have where like their uncle or like aunt is six months older than like their niece. You know what mean?

Ice Bear (1:09:24)
older than that. Yeah.

Mm hmm.

Yep. Yep. I've seen that situation a lot too. Okay. So you're ready for a good one?

Okay. Bear with me, because I'm gonna have to remember the good one. So you might have to stall for me. This is the quality content that Pakistan's here for.

⁓ no, this is terrible. I don't remember what we're talking about at all.

Grizz (1:10:00)
twins age gap and I was talking about where the uncle is like the same age just months apart from their niece

Ice Bear (1:10:05)
Yeah, yeah,

yeah, yeah, we were talking about that. We were indeed talking about that. All right, let's move on. If I remember it, I'll come back to it. It's going to be a massive waste of time otherwise. And I will just interject aggressively.

Grizz (1:10:21)
What are you doing being response?

Yeah, you got enough responsible points to be like, nah, fuck that. This is what we were talking about earlier. Double. ⁓

Ice Bear (1:10:36)
I think this is an A. It's really, it's very enjoyable. It's a smooth kryptonite logger.

Grizz (1:10:38)
And amen.

Ice Bear (1:10:48)
Okay, I remembered it. So my youngest uncle, and again, this is like a 20 year age gap with my oldest uncles and my dad. When he was a baby and a toddler, and they were kind of like, you know, watching over him, he's so picture him in like a bassinet or crib. One of the things that they loved to do to this insanely fucked up looking at it in hindsight is

And for context, my uncle's name is Sam. They would say, Good boy, Sam. Good boy. Bad boy, Sam. Bad boy. They just wanted to fuck with this concept of good and bad. They would say bad soothingly in a very gentle tone. And they'd say good super aggressively. And I'm like, that's, that's a wild, like psychological torture. Imagine doing that to a pet.

Grizz (1:11:44)
I mean like that's fair. You remember that John money experiment like back in the day where like those two twins and he just like decided to like I don't know if one was hermaphrodite or not but he just decided to raise one as a girl one as a boy but they both were boys and then so like you're like no you're a girl and then he like grew up with all this fucked up things and then like he and hermaphrodite himself yeah okay the John money experiments wild

Ice Bear (1:12:05)
No, I'm totally unaware of this.

no, that's awful.

Grizz (1:12:14)
Yeah, was really wild.

Ice Bear (1:12:22)
gets hairy. What was the one I don't want you to describe it because it's it's not good not good content. But what's the one we were talking about where you had a book on kind of the horrendous atrocities of World War Two. And it was something that Japan was doing. Yeah, yeah, that's it.

Grizz (1:12:28)
Hahaha!

the Repentant King.

⁓ or unit 731.

Ice Bear (1:12:46)
That's it, unit 730, that's the one. That's the one. So don't look into that unless you want your day ruined.

Grizz (1:12:53)
Yeah, you can't see the top shelf. But yeah, I got a couple books on them. It's wild. People call it the Auschwitz of the east. No, it's like it's no, it's wild. Like, have you ever heard of? No, no, we're gonna say before I say it.

Ice Bear (1:12:59)
home.

horrendous so horrendous cuz you weren't you telling me go ahead sorry

Weren't you telling me that that's the reason why we know how much water is in the human body?

Grizz (1:13:18)
that or like how we know how much pressure happens when like we get pressurized like when like things happen because you know they did they tested it so like do know what a vivectomy is?

Ice Bear (1:13:31)
a Vivectomy that would be a vasectomy performed by Aunt Viv from Fresh Prince of Bel Air.

Grizz (1:13:40)
So good. How'd you, how'd you know that? It's a live day section.

Ice Bear (1:13:42)
What is a fact?

No, I don't like that at all.

Grizz (1:13:51)
They wonder how I kept the bodies reacted differently like when alive or dead and how they would you know so like they they perform regular of effectiveness and see the The reason the way it happened was like at first they were just doing it on prisoners You know like people they were like did crime attack people this and that and they're like well they deserve to be punished anyway, so fuck them and Then they ran out of prisoners. So they were like let's just start fucking making everybody prisoners

And then like, yeah, it got it got really wild really quick. But yeah, and the crazy thing is that like, the whole shelf front for the area in like Manchuria, that this crazy basically fucking human experiment concentration camp thing was, was a water purification like facility.

Because Shiro Ishii, he was the mastermind behind it. He's the guy that created this water filtration system in Japan. He created that because of war, because the Spanish war, sicknesses and things would destroy armies. And so he was like, well, how did we get around? So he created this water filtration system.

that like worked really well. he's, you know, with the army, ended up going public and selling it to the public, all this other stuff. And then he was very much in the Japanese Imperial Army stuff. So he was like, you know, Imperial Japan's the thing. You know, so like, and it just kept kind of going until he was like, the Emperor show Reign Supreme, and he started, you know, doing all the things. But yeah, was wild. So like,

Ice Bear (1:15:38)
That is crazy.

Grizz (1:15:41)
I'm very anti-war, I'm also not a huge fan of the main head and project stuff and the two nuclear warheads. But one of the things that Shido Ishii was doing was chemical warfare. What he was doing, was basically the bubonic plague. He just infected a fuck ton of rats and fleas. He put rats, them down.

Ice Bear (1:15:49)
Mm-hmm.

Grizz (1:16:05)
with the disease and had fleece festering on him. He attached him to a bunch of balloon things and he was going to try to send them over to the U.S. And as as like the cool as the walls were closing in around the camp, he was like, send everything. Fuck it. Right. Like, like just send everything to the U.S. like, you know, to try to to try to get to it first. And then the second this is the second bomb dropped. And then he is like, fuck. And then he said at first because like the emperor

Ice Bear (1:16:22)
Ugh.

Grizz (1:16:34)
like submits and says like you know like we out we're not doing this no more kind of thing like surrender the emperor surrenders and he's like after the first bomb

And so he's like, fuck this, nah, fuck it, Imperial Japan, land of the rising sun, we rising. And so he's like, he's prepping the things to like shoot off all the bubonic plague rats and fleas and shit to the US. And then the second bomb drops, then he's like, fuck this shit. We can't deal with this. And so he stopped, they stop it. So like inadvertently, the second fucked up bomb, like the whole Hiroshima stuff, like actually stopped this crazy.

I'm ⁓

Ice Bear (1:17:18)
It's so wild.

Yeah,

that's one of the brutal things about considering on a macro level the nature of warfare. Because objectively, people are doing fucked up things.

but are they preventing more fucked up things?

Grizz (1:17:50)
Yeah. And the thing that's funny too is that like the hero in that, in that whole, that time, right? Going into like the whole like Raven and King stuff, the hero of it was a Nazi.

Ice Bear (1:18:04)
Hmm. Educate me, please.

Grizz (1:18:04)
yeah so like for like during it's like

so like during the whole Nanking stuff from the ripening king and going into that area of like in China there was a Nazi doctor that was like he was a Nazi but he was still very much of the thing of like when Hitler was old talks of like

Rebuilding Germany and kind of like we were we were destroyed by the treaties of World War one We were destined to like we're gonna bring back, know stronger Germany all the stuff like all great and everything like and you know, so everybody rally behind him He got stationed in my cheerios he got stationed in China and then King And so he's Has no idea that like after that the whole Holocaust started, you know, and and Hitler went crazy because of like the whole messed up, right?

And so there's letters for him saying like, Hey, Japan's supposed to be an ally and they're doing all this fucked up stuff. They're committing war crimes. It's not, need to come and save these people. Like, you know what I mean? Like he's pleading to Hitler to like come help. Right. And so cause Japan's like fucking literally mutilating or raping people. Like I'm back. Like there was a, there was a ongoing contest or how much people, innocent people like

these two generals can kill and they were like just advertising paper like general fucking Japanese guy one was fucking killed 37 people this time he killed to 38 was tuning next week you know to be kind of shit like as wild right and so like a few brutal rape rape vans from like all the way to tiny children to women

like they forced sons to rape mothers and vice versa fathers rape daughters and like force the monks like it's fucked up stuff the hero one of the heroes main heroes was this nazi doctor because he again he had no idea he was just a doctor he was ahead of me to be a nazi because before hitler went fucking crazy and all the stuff whether that was his intention or not

⁓ you know, he had supporters cause like just to rebuild their country and all the other stuff he has stationed in over there. And so all these atrocities are happening. And so he's doing his best to help the people in the community. So he's saving people through surgeries and doing all this shit. And he's like pleading and sending letters to the fucking Nazis to stop Japan from committing these war crimes all the while Hitler's committing all these fucking war crimes, you know, back home. has no idea.

And so it's crazy that one of the heroes of Dan King was a Nazi. He's a Nazi doctor.

Ice Bear (1:20:47)
wild.

The human experience is just a bizarre and fascinating thing.

Grizz (1:21:02)
It's insane, man.

It's completely wild like uh, his name was john rabe arabic like he was a german businessman and a Member of the nazi party who became a hero during the nanking massacre in 1937 By saving thousands of chinese civilians. He established an the nanking safety zone which sheltered approximately 250 chinese people from the imperial japanese army

Despite his Nazi affiliations, Raab or rabbi, I don't know, he used his position to protect civilians and document the atrocities committing during the massacre. His actions earned him the title of the living Buddha of Nanking among the Chinese population. And he was a Nazi. But again, because he was part of the party in 37s was before like the Holocaust for full into full roar. You know what I mean?

Ice Bear (1:21:53)
Yeah.

Grizz (1:21:54)
So he had no idea that like that shit was going on back home.

Ice Bear (1:22:09)
fascinating.

And it's one of those things where I often think, given the current craziness in the world, if we fast forward 40 years, are people going to look at Palestine or Ukraine in the same way now? Like, why the fuck didn't you do anything?

Grizz (1:22:37)
the Ukraine one's hard because it's a proxy war. That one's kind of harder because it's just two superpowers using puppets to whatever right like that's a little harder. palisade one is interesting because like you have two sentiments right like the Jewish sentiment at least like for like the more like Zionist sentiment is

Ice Bear (1:22:39)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Grizz (1:22:59)
Jewish people were kicked out of all these other things. We were given this area, like we were given back our homeland after the Holocaust and all this other kind of stuff and you know, all those things. The other side is where like we've lived here for centuries. You're pushing us out, like you're, you know, it's just like, we'll give you this certain part of land, but then like you keep taking more.

Ice Bear (1:23:09)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Grizz (1:23:24)
kinda thing until you fight back and so we had we try to go diplomatically and then because of that extremists like y'all motherfuckers are too weak we're gonna save us and so now you have these extreme types that are like taking the helm and then they're like and then the other side's like well see though they're they're you know what I mean it's like it's just it's it goes back and forth and it's it's one of these like convoluted things that one's gonna be

interesting when the dust settles because it's going to be like how much of which is true on either side because both are claiming war crimes and both are claiming this and who knows maybe both are right but until we have the outside ones again they were gonna know exactly right like I mean like we all have our dispositions of like what side we on like I'm bold on one side that I think would be true but like ⁓

It's gonna be interesting in the sense of like When we actually have actual data

Ice Bear (1:24:32)
Yeah, I was chuckling

because I was like, do we want to go full barely to go to do we have opinions on this?

Grizz (1:24:41)
I mean like, you know, I'll just say that my more status Texas brethren tend to disagree with me on this one. You know, but like.

Ice Bear (1:24:57)
Mm-mm.

Grizz (1:24:59)
say it but but yeah it's gonna be interesting when like the dust settles particularly with this one but then again it's like this region's been at war for centuries it's a graveyard of empires like or not not specifically Palestine and stuff but like the Middle East in general right like Afghanistan and like

Ice Bear (1:25:01)
was saying.

Mm-hmm. That's true.

Yeah, just,

yeah, absolutely.

Grizz (1:25:23)
It's

like, Alexander the Great and beyond like Empire's fall there.

Ice Bear (1:25:28)
Ottomans, Mongolians

like yeah, absolutely.

Grizz (1:25:32)
Yeah,

the US sunk 20 years into there for nothing. And then like our flirting for more like... Empire's fall.

Ice Bear (1:25:42)
Yep. Yep.

Yep.

Bless you.

Grizz (1:25:52)
That's Now you know what's a great book outside of all this shit is Misashi.

Ice Bear (1:25:53)
Thank you.

Grizz (1:26:03)
one of the long no no so Musashi the book is the I guess like the dramaticized version of the story of Miyamoto Musashi the guy that wrote the book of five rings it's kind of like this dramaticized version of his life fantastic fucking book it's like it's a long book it's one of like the longest novels ever just in Japan fantastic like I fucking like literally shaped like

Ice Bear (1:26:03)
like book book of five rings.

Grizz (1:26:30)
part of the reason that shaped my moral compass right like fantastic fucking book.

like ⁓

Absolutely amazing book.

Ice Bear (1:26:52)
interest

Grizz (1:26:54)
The anime Vagabond.

Ice Bear (1:26:58)
Okay, yeah, I'm more of it. haven't seen it.

Grizz (1:26:59)
is based

is based on the the masashi novel about Miyamoto Masashi's life like if you don't read the long ass book because it's a long fucking book great book though the anime vagabond is the anime of that story and it's fucking great

Ice Bear (1:27:05)
⁓ okay.

I remember Okay, is this no, no, no, this is something different. I remember in high school, I got the tale of Genji for Yeah, and I thought that was like, at one point, I thought that was the longest book maze. No, is it? No, who knows?

Grizz (1:27:35)
Tug-in is just great.

Ice Bear (1:27:46)
Anyway, I got it and I got probably 300 pages in and then I was in high school and I lost interest. I just couldn't. But now that I'm an adult, I'm kind of wondering, should I go back and try and finish that? I feel like I should.

Grizz (1:27:55)
That's fair. That's really fair, though.

Ice Bear (1:28:07)
You know another one that people say you should read that I've never finished? Anything by James Joyce. Like, have you ever finished Ulysses?

Grizz (1:28:17)
Yes, I have.

Ice Bear (1:28:18)
shit okay do i do it should i

Grizz (1:28:26)
I don't know, man. like, for like Western writing in general, like I think Ulysses is great. But I think if you have a general understanding and you read like later stuff, I think it's kind of just as good or not better, to be honest. I think it's good, like it's good source material to use because like once you read that and you read later things, you're like, oh shit, that's where they you know what I mean?

Ice Bear (1:28:46)
Okay.

Grizz (1:28:55)
But like, I don't think it's anything that's like ground-shattering unless like you go to like...

you know, like you were trying to go like complete history of everything. You know what mean? Like it's kind of

Ice Bear (1:29:11)
All right, give the people and me a must read. And absolutely, just every person should read this book. Give me give me one of those. Whatever the first thing that pops in your head is don't don't feel like you have to rank it just give give give the peeps something that they should read.

I have one right away if you want more time to think.

Grizz (1:29:42)
You tell me yours first.

Ice Bear (1:29:45)
Okay, this and this is good because this is a short manageable book. I think every person should read Siddhartha by Hermann Hesse.

Grizz (1:29:57)
So that's a good one.

You know what, I, it's not my favorite book, but it's a short book and it's a fucking phenomenal book. And it kind of like, it's like the whole like birthplace of like the whole like logos stuff, right? Like, ⁓

I think a book that's worth reading because it kind of like tells like personal tales like in history and struggle and it kind of brings it into like modern like I say modern but like modern Western like 80 years ago but like you know what is Victor Frankl's visit man search for meaning

Ice Bear (1:30:46)
Ooh.

Grizz (1:30:48)
So are you familiar with Viktor Frankl?

Ice Bear (1:30:51)
I'm not, but I feel like you've mentioned this

to me before and I've written it down and then I've never gotten around to reading it.

Grizz (1:30:56)
So

Victor and I'm talking about the book is like this thick. It's fucking, it's not, it's short book. You can, it's a weekend read at most, but Victor Frankel was a Holocaust survivor, right? Like his whole entire family, like they lived well in Germany. They lived great. His whole entire family was either killed or lost like by the Nazis going into concentration camps. Wife has killed in the concentration camp.

family was killed in a time-tripping camp. He was basically like the only survivor, virtually the only survivor, lived through the concentration camp. And then like after coming out, having nobody, lost everything. Like, you know, like he had a pretty privileged life before, lost everything. The love of his life was killed in front of him, is, everything, everybody that he did was murdered brutally.

And so he came with this whole like Logos stuff, like the Logos, ⁓ basically this mentality of like, ⁓ one of the fours is like, to like this, to live is to suffer, right? To live is to suffer, to, to suffer is, ⁓ to survive is to find meaning in the suffering. And so no matter the lowest point of your life or how terrible something is finding, finding meaning within it.

is gonna like be your lifeline. And so this man that was like they went through literally lost everything in the most brutal ways possible, came back on the other side became like a therapist for like this whole logo therapy thing of like finding meaning within the lowest points of your life and going to a thing and so like this whole book is like his story, the stories of like within the concentration camps and then like how he applied it to just normal life after the fact. And it's a short book.

It's a phenomenal book. think like I think that's a must read for people because it's an easy read.

Ice Bear (1:33:02)
I like it. I'm fully on board with that. That's good homework.

Grizz (1:33:09)
You almost are you done with your beer? I almost have the beer.

Ice Bear (1:33:11)
I can be. I can be done very quickly.

Grizz (1:33:16)
I got like, got like another two swigs.

Ice Bear (1:33:18)
Okay, yeah, same.

Grizz (1:33:20)
Yeah, I don't know Russia these swigs.

Ice Bear (1:33:29)
So obviously the smoothest transition possible is ⁓ Dame Lillard. He's got his contract bought out by the bucks. That's wild.

Grizz (1:33:42)
You know what's even

crazier is that the Spurs get two picks.

No, they didn't. Who did they get? They got somebody really good recently.

Ice Bear (1:33:56)
The only pick I paid attention to was Dallas and Cooper flag.

But I have heard that the Spurs are on the top list for places LeBron might go.

Grizz (1:34:15)
I don't want him fucking into this purse. Nah, fuck that.

Ice Bear (1:34:17)
Yes, you do. If you if

you're a Spurs fan, LeBron and Wemby would be fantastic because they're not giving up Castle for him. So you've got Castle, you've got LeBron, it probably like a small forward kind of roll and Wemby. If that happens, they're front runners for winning the chip.

Grizz (1:34:26)
That's fair.

For sure. see, here's the thing. I will be a Mavericks fan before I'm a Spurs fan. It's heresy for Spurs people. I know. But, Dirk Nowinski, bro. Fuck off. So like.

Ice Bear (1:34:55)
The the

the other one by the way because you and I both love the Mavs ⁓ That is rumored is LeBron to the Mavs for for No, no, no, get don't get too crazy because it's not a bad trade for either side. It was for clay Clay ⁓ one of the first rounds in 2029 and ⁓

Grizz (1:35:05)
I will die.

Ice Bear (1:35:25)
gaff. So you'd still have you'd still have Kai, you'd still have AD, you'd have LeBron, you'd have PJ. That's a good fucking team that could work.

Grizz (1:35:39)
That's fair. I give a fuck about Kai. love Kai. Kai went to the Mavs. was like insanely happy. ⁓ I just fucking hate LeBron to be honest. It's like, it's like, it's like if Tom Brady went to like the Ravens or like Tom Brady went to the Cowboys, I'd be like, fuck this guy. You know, to be like,

Ice Bear (1:35:54)
I get that. That's fair.

So this is how Steelers fans are feeling right now with Aaron Rodgers.

Grizz (1:36:07)
Yeah, I was just the exact same way. I don't hate Aaron Rodgers though. So I'm fine with that. like, but for a Steelers fan, yeah, that's normal. You should hate Aaron Rodgers. So I get it. But I can't stand fucking LeBron. There's so much things about LeBron that I can't stand. I will especially not. I don't like LeBron for LeBron, but I also hate LeBron because of the fans. This whole like goat talk is always like, it's always annoys me.

but like, I would say I'm still the like Jordan's a goat. If you go talk about the new age goat, I think it has to be Kobe. And I hate Kobe. I don't know. I'm a huge fan of Kobe either. I would say Kobe over Lebron.

Ice Bear (1:36:39)
Who's the goat?

interesting. Very interesting. Because

for me, Kobe's not top 10. Really. Not top 10.

Grizz (1:36:55)
Really? Interesting. So as

a holistically or just as individual stats?

Ice Bear (1:37:05)
I think Kobe's right there at like an 11, 12, kind of.

Grizz (1:37:05)
Really? I would...

Who would you put over a copy?

Ice Bear (1:37:14)
Who would I put over Kobe?

Grizz (1:37:15)
as

as the goat so go we have to be like all encompassing right like a kind of like the greatest

Ice Bear (1:37:20)
100 %

okay. So who am I putting over Cubby? Jordan, LeBron, Magic, Kareem, Hakim, Shaq, Bird.

Grizz (1:37:26)
Yeah, of course you're joining,

Okay.

So you, OK, OK, OK. So this is interesting too, right? So like.

It's kind of fair because I think when I think of the goat, I don't think of like the legends. You know what I mean?

Ice Bear (1:37:47)
Interesting. So you're thinking more modern.

Grizz (1:37:49)
Because when I think of legends like Larry Bird, Kareem, these motherfuckers are the people that shaped the sport. And so I don't factor them in to the goat. You know what I mean? So that's actually interesting, because if I factor everybody in, maybe it might be different.

I would say, I think like Jordan's better than Kobe. And I think he was, especially anybody that says otherwise, like I think it's stupid, especially with like how brutal and how like physical and how difficult, like how the bulls were like the,

Ice Bear (1:38:27)
So I

will preface this for you and for everyone else that often, and I still believe this, I put someone above Jordan before LeBron even came into the league. I was always a huge proponent of Oscar Robertson. So Oscar Robertson, for those that don't know,

played for the Cincinnati Royals way back in the day. And yes, part of this is because I'm a huge Cincinnati fan. But the main reason is this man averaged a triple double in an era where it was not fucking possible. He also averaged a triple double in an area where racism was so fucking commonplace. Every away game, this man was getting bombarded with slurs and insults that would make any modern day player just

fucking cry and point at the fan and be like, get him ejected, get him ejected. Oscar Robertson was the embodiment, in my opinion, of an unselfish team player that exuded excellence in every category.

Grizz (1:39:43)
So I am tacitly aware of Oscar Robinson, right, because of like, just general fandoms.

But.

Ice Bear (1:39:55)
So he was

the first player that ever averaged a triple double for a season. So until Russ did it, you know, like, fuck what, seven, eight years ago, he was the only one that had ever done it. He has a ring. He got his ring. So it's not like he doesn't have a championship pedigree, but he was excellent across the board in all aspects of the game in a way that no one else ever was.

Grizz (1:40:21)
So I won't deny that, especially because I don't know as much about him. ⁓ In his division, how strong were the teams were at the time when he was playing?

Ice Bear (1:40:35)
This was the same era with like Russell wilt. So like, yes, like if you, if you're saying like, they were plumbers and firefighters. If you have the JJ redic mindset, yes. Was competition a little bit easier? Sure. But I think it's weird to punish people for, cause he had the same training, the same nutrition, the same.

all the same advantage. Like, it's not like he had a weird advantage. It's just it was product of the era.

Grizz (1:41:02)
Yeah.

Well, I would say I yeah, yes.

Yeah, so I would say that. So like, for me, there's why Jean Jordan's a goat is like, not only of his work ethic and like all the crazy stuff that he did, and like how carfucking dynamic he was, was like the league he was in at the time was extremely brutal.

Ice Bear (1:41:24)
If you want to talk about most impactful, it's Jordan. If you want to talk about greatest work ethic, him and Kobe are like a toss up. I will entertain the argument for the Mamba mentality thing.

Grizz (1:41:29)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. And here's the thing. Here's

the thing. I hate Kobe. I hate Kobe. And I think like my cousin who my closest to is basically like my brother loves Kobe. And I will talk shit about Kobe to the top dead. Right. But with that being said,

Ice Bear (1:41:41)
Me too. Me too.

Mm-hmm.

Grizz (1:41:57)
Kobe was fucking, you know what mean? So the work of the thing I'll give him, but the thing that I give over Kobe with Jordan is that like the competition for Jordan was way fucking harder than anything else. And he still dominated the way he did. Like around the time before like rules got changed a little bit and before the time of like, well shit thing, like Jordan had some fucking blood bath fucking matches and he still came out supreme. You know what I mean?

Ice Bear (1:42:24)
Mm hmm. Yeah, 100%. Okay. While I'm talking about this, can you try and look it up? Because I would like I would like the people to see this. So here is and again, for me, all time, Kobe's probably 1112. But if you're one of the people that has Kobe like top three, this is the clip that in my mind makes it a legitimate argument. There's a clip somewhere of Kobe

Grizz (1:42:30)
Yeah, go, go, go, go.

Ice Bear (1:42:52)
it's an inbound play and they're about to inbound the ball and he like shoves it in his face like he's gonna chuck it and Kobe does not flinch the balls like this fucking close to his face and he's just like

Grizz (1:43:03)
Dude, yeah, and he just,

it's such a cold fucking clip, like video. Co, yeah.

Ice Bear (1:43:08)
that that is the most

I can't think of anything in in basketball that's ever been as cold as that because he's just a

Grizz (1:43:18)
Yeah,

because it doesn't give a fuck. It literally doesn't move a fucking millimeter.

Ice Bear (1:43:26)
And to that point, if you have become competitive to the point that you can override your brain chemistry and not flinch when a fucking thing that's going to break your nose is like this far from your fucking face. Yes, you deserve credit. So if you're asking me about like work ethic or brain power, sure. Kobe is I will Kobe's probably number one. It was in.

incredible his desire to be the best.

Grizz (1:43:58)
Yeah, again, so like for me, I wouldn't put Kobe as a goat either, right? But like, when I say the goat, like, again, and it's kind of interesting, I've never thought about it, like a factoring in like the more like legends with everything. I think to me, it's like a different era to where like, it's not even where like, it's not where whether it's

Like you hit legendary status here not obtainable anymore or like it's just a separate whole thing. I never even even factored that right So i've never even thought about like fucking bird johnson or any of these other like these guys are like Literally shaped the game around him and whether you like shrek or not, too He literally shaped the game around him Rules got changed in the NBA because of him

You can change say whatever the fuck you want about him, but like he literally shaped the NBA. You know, he's so.

Ice Bear (1:44:50)
100 %

Shaq and Wilt, those two have defined the league. Half of the rules in the NBA are because of Shaq and Wilt and how fucking insanely dominant they were.

Grizz (1:44:58)
Yeah.

Yes. You

can say whatever the fuck you want about them, but it's true. Right. So like you can hate them, whatever, but it's, it's an undoubtable fact. Right. So like one of my favorite things about shack is not shack. It's every Spears impression of shack.

Ice Bear (1:45:20)
Oh,

oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh,

Cross side every time.

Grizz (1:45:36)
I just had to that out there. But, so, so yeah, that, so like, I think of this goat, like at least like in the public thing or like the jet, not the, the norming context, right. I, when I think about that and I think of this whole thing, the fact that yes, LeBron's done a lot and lots of bronze, everything, but like, I don't, I don't think you, I, I don't think LeBron holds a thing, a candle to Kobe. I really don't. And I hate Kobe.

I kind of don't as like as as a player as an individual I just I see you see both of them playing I don't see it. And then like even to Jordan to like so like like LeBron's LeBron things even when he was in the sixers like even everything the battles to get his ring is we're nowhere near as crazy as like Jordans were

Ice Bear (1:46:33)
Man, so I totally disagree. Because here's the thing, I don't think people that love Jordan remember how fucking good Scottie Pippen and Dennis Rodman were.

Grizz (1:46:37)
So, where was you?

Which is true.

Which is fair. ⁓

Ice Bear (1:46:52)
Scottie Pippen is so far and away in his prime better than Dwayne Wade and Dennis Rodman is miles fucking better than Chris Bosh. And on the Cavs team that won, was him and Kai. Kevin Love wasn't really involved. Kevin Love's a great player. I Kevin Love a lot, but he was only really Kevin Love on the Timberwolves.

Grizz (1:46:59)
yeah.

and

Fair?

Ice Bear (1:47:19)
And on the Lakers team, was him and Nadine. There was no third. And Jordan's supporting cast was fucking good. Steve Kerr was great. ⁓

Grizz (1:47:23)
So his...

Yeah. True, true. But

my thing is like, undeniable, very true. But also like, you have to look at the teams that like the team's lineup, like the defense lineup of during the playoffs, like when George Jordan won his rings, like they were also fucking killers to

Ice Bear (1:47:50)
LeBron's first ring was Kevin Durant, James Harden, and Russell Westbrook.

Grizz (1:47:56)
that one's fair too. that was like, that's why I separated like the whole six years thing because I think the six years I think like, during that era of Lebron, I think because you had the biggest argument for him being the goat. Are up and coming.

Ice Bear (1:48:10)
You don't think Tim

Duncan, Kawhi Leonard and fucking Manu was good? You're a fucking Texas boy. That Spurs team was stacked.

Grizz (1:48:17)
It's fair.

But the thing with the spurs thing is interesting because that spurs team was always stacked.

Ice Bear (1:48:25)
Steph

Curry, Draymond Green, and Clay Thompson.

Grizz (1:48:30)
But also like so say when I kind of say that what my differentiating is more of like on the defensive side right like Because like Steph Curry and all them thing

Ice Bear (1:48:38)
There is

no defense in the modern NBA. It doesn't exist.

Grizz (1:48:42)
which is which

is fair. So I guess that's where like, the sticking point is right because like back in the 90s or was more so of a thing.

Ice Bear (1:48:50)
Here's the thing,

if you were allowed to ref games and play defense like you were in the 90s and 80s in the modern NBA, look at LeBron's frame. He's fucking bigger and more athletic than any of those fuckers. He would have worked if he was allowed to do what they were allowed to do. He would have been fine.

Grizz (1:49:11)
That's fair. I guess for me, the thing is that when you see some of the things with Lebron, especially when he kind of like, he doesn't crash out, but when he kind of throws the.

Ice Bear (1:49:20)
But that's your that that is because

that that gets results. He's competitive. If if you weren't allowed to whine the way you do now, I 100 % agree. He whines so much and my

Grizz (1:49:26)
Yeah, so I, yeah.

Which is like

the reason why I don't like LeBron's the same reason why I don't like Tom Brady Even though they're both undoubtedly great is because they both fucking wine and all the other shit

Ice Bear (1:49:43)
dude,

my favorite player, as you know, is Luca, he winds a fuckton. He has temper tantrums nonstop. But it's because that is what the league reacts to. It gets results. He gets more calls because of it. So I don't blame him for doing it.

Grizz (1:49:48)
he does.

It's for you playing the game. definitely I get that right so I I guess to me like for me Yeah Yeah, it's true

Ice Bear (1:50:07)
It's fucking every NBA player now it's fucking soft and if you're

asking me were the 80s and 90s objectively harder 100 % they're way tougher

Grizz (1:50:16)
Yeah.

And so that's why I'm like, so when you talk about the goat thing, right? Are we talking about just stats? Are we talking about all encompassing? guess because to me, this whole goat talk is always cultural. You know what I mean? I think there's this implicit thing where it kind of is that, right? And so to me, I think Jordan will kind of hold that torch always.

Ice Bear (1:50:27)
everything.

Grizz (1:50:46)
I think the only one that got closest to it was Kobe because of the way he was. think LeBron and as much as I hate LeBron, LeBron is a fucking assassin. That guy's a fucking monster. And you know, you made a fair point right now that I kind of really didn't think. LeBron is a beast. As much as I can don't like the guy, it's kind of the same thing as Tom Brady. As much as I fucking hate the guy, you can't like, yeah, okay.

He is that he would farewell in this he I think LeBron would farewell in the 90s It's one of those of like how much How much is it him being like whiny like kind of like bitch type thing or is he just playing the fucking game and like Using it using the rules to his advantage and he's being smart That's a good that's a good thing that I kind of like really don't factor in

Ice Bear (1:51:35)
Okay.

Here's here's my best example. Picture picture the 90s. Picture 2014 LeBron playing in the 90s. Playing in that era where the refs are reffing the way they ref against the Knicks. And he's backing down Patrick Ewing, who is a fucking gem and I love Patrick Ewing. I've loved him since Georgetown.

Lebron is backing down Patrick Ewing and Patrick Ewing isn't going to do shit. He's stronger. He's more athletic. He's faster.

It's gonna happen. And it's I think it's purely a product of the way the league is now. Because the other thing is Magic Johnson, if you put him in today's league, I think magic is 4015 and 10 every fucking night.

Grizz (1:52:24)
That's fair.

Ice Bear (1:52:36)
Like, it's one of the things where like comparing arrows is really hard because the the refs do call the game way differently and people play the game way differently.

Grizz (1:52:46)
Yeah,

that's fair. Cause I want to think about it because I'm much more comfortable like NFL. So when you think of like Ray Lewis or even like the Legion of boom, half the shit they did is fucking illegal now.

Ice Bear (1:52:58)
Okay,

so that perfect if we want to switch us an FL picture Dick Butkus and the fucking 80s Bears in the same league that the 2000 Ravens were in. Like the Ravens do that. Don't get me wrong. I was in Maryland. I remember how fucking stacked that Ravens D offense was. And I remember watching Trent fucking Dilfer win a Super Bowl. What?

Grizz (1:53:00)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ha

Ice Bear (1:53:27)
If

you put the 80s Bears in that same league, they would have been undefeated. They would have been 17, you know, whatever the undefeated record, 19, 20.

Like, the the leagues have gotten softer and understandably so because they're trying to protect assets. I get it. I get they don't want these multi-million dollar players getting fucking murdered.

But man like there's there's a lot of players now that if you I think a lot of people think It's a soft league now. They would have died back then they would not have died back then They would have just played different

Grizz (1:54:09)
That's true.

That's true. That's one of the things I admit, especially with the NBA, I kind of didn't think. I guess because you just see the plays, see the games or whatever, and you kind of just take it by face value. What I don't give is how much of the other just playing the game because they're playing the games within the parameter of what they're given.

And so they're just being smart as opposed to like being what they can actually capably do.

Ice Bear (1:54:39)
Okay, so prime example picture. So we already discussed you and I are like a three year age gap. LeBron and I are like a three year age gap the other way. When I was in high school and LeBron got drafted, he did not appear three years older than me. LeBron when he got drafted looked fucking 20 years old. He looked 35 when he got drafted.

Grizz (1:54:51)
Yeah.

True.

Ice Bear (1:55:08)
Like he came into the league a grown fucking man.

Grizz (1:55:10)
I do remember when LeBron first started came.

I do remember when LeBron came into like, he was making waves. That's why I like separated like, freaking Cleveland LeBron with like, LeBron's after right, like the later ones. Because I could because it was it was different. I think I because during that era, especially when he was like making a name for himself, like

Ice Bear (1:55:26)
Sure. ⁓

Grizz (1:55:36)
I will give into the fact LeBron, so like with Kobe, Kobe started making this stuff for a while, like two, three years after. Right? Like it kind of took a minute.

Ice Bear (1:55:45)
Kobe became Kobe after the lost championship to Detroit. After the three-peat and Shaq left, that's when Kobe became Kobe.

Yes.

Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Grizz (1:56:26)
I put LeBron like I'm not a fan of LeBron. don't like LeBron. But I put him to like Tom Brady where like I'm not a fan of Brady. don't like Tom Brady. He's a bitch. Like I hate the way he bitches about shit. But he's undeniably good. You say he sucks. You're a fucking liar. I don't give a fuck what what you think.

Ice Bear (1:56:40)
Yeah.

And that's a great like Tom Brady thing. I hated Brady. I hated him. But his last Super Bowl on the Pats and the Super Bowl on the Bucks, was just like. He's fucking he's just fucking good. He's just hyper competitive and undeniably good.

Grizz (1:56:58)
Undeniably good. He's undeniably good.

You can say whatever the fuck you want about this individual, but he's undeniably fucking good. And that's how I always felt about Lebron was like, I'm not a fan of Lebron. I hate Kobe, but I kind of hate Kobe more just because of my cousin. Like, know, to be fair, right. But like, but like, ⁓ but

Ice Bear (1:57:17)
Yeah.

Grizz (1:57:23)
he LeBron was one words I would say LeBron's the NBA Tom Brady for me. Undeniably good, but like everything around him was like, I fucked this guy, you know? But but that is one I the fact that you brought up of like, the bitching us now, like it's just playing the game like you're you're just playing within the parameters of the rules you're given now.

Ice Bear (1:57:30)
That's fair. That's a good equivalency. That's a very good equivalency.

Yeah.

Grizz (1:57:52)
And so if you put, if you can put him in that time now, how would he thrive in this time of the nineties? Because like as much as I like, as much as I things about Lebron, there are times when he's faced strong defenses and like, I wouldn't say he crumbles, but like he bitches more. does this, whatever more, right?

Ice Bear (1:58:09)
Dude, the block

is the best play of his career, by far. Put the block in that Game 7 Warriors series above anything, above any shot, above any dunk, it's the best play of his career. And that fucking chase down, it's him as a career personified. He's fast, he's fucking big, and he has crazy IQ.

Grizz (1:58:14)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, I will say that you've successfully given Shine Lebron a better light to me in this thing. I'll give you that's what I'm like. You got a point.

Ice Bear (1:58:50)
you

Hahaha

Alright, and speaking of got a point, I think we've made a lot of good points. I think we're also approaching a two hour time frame. What was your, what was your beer experience like tonight?

Grizz (1:59:08)
Yeah.

Here we go. B plus.

shit. Texas blood. You've started with an F. You now have a C. I will give you a C. And this motherfucker right here, technical skill set. You got a technical fucking A. You are a beautiful 90s era Scotty Pippen.

Ice Bear (1:59:40)
Speaking of A's...

Grizz (1:59:43)
Cross the board.

Ice Bear (1:59:44)
A's.

A's across the board, flying monkeys. ⁓ I don't remember for sure, but I feel like this was also an A. I feel like my 10.8 beaver was also an A. And then I feel like ⁓ our little beachy boy was like a C plus, B minus, of good but forgettable. So I think that's that.

Grizz (1:59:54)
I think it was. I think it should be in there.

I think we're good.

Ice Bear (2:00:12)
I think we should give him a salute to say bye.